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15 minutes ago, hunsworthhound said:

Just heard on LBC the BLM lot want to change the name of Downing Street as the bloke who gave it to the nation in the 18th Century had some connection to the slave trade. When will it end pull down Stonehenge  as no doubt our ancient ancestors must have had some slaves didn't  everybody back then.

Slavery is evil but there is no race on earth that does not have it somewhere in its past. Even the current protesters if they look far enough back in history will find they have some connection to owning slaves.

 

 

I've not seen anything about Downing Street on Twitter, and I'm not sure about all races having history of slavery (could be true, I don't know), but there needs to be a some restraint in the actions and demands of BLM/the left or else the divide will increase... which is the opposite of what the movement wants to achieve.

 

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Dont worry, Ive worked out what you are like. We are repeatedly told by people like yourself how divided we are as a country. But this division is stoked and encouraged by people like yourself. A

I've copied this, author unknown, but I agree with every word:- According to the BBC today, I'm complicit in hate and racist crimes because I'm White and I won't join in with the meaningless piec

And when we cut through all the ****, this is the main problem. We should be offended that in 2020 people are not being treated equal. We should be looking at how we resolve this, how we stop the

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20 minutes ago, Bubba said:

:lol::lol::lol: because it was a differing view to yours? Its like a racist saying 'its the black people that caused the division in the first place'.

No it isnt! And you will see that I am right in the not too distant future.

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11 minutes ago, never_shay_die said:

I've not seen anything about Downing Street on Twitter, and I'm not sure about all races having history of slavery (could be true, I don't know), but there needs to be a some restraint in the actions and demands of BLM/the left or else the divide will increase... which is the opposite of what the movement wants to achieve.

 

I like your very subtle admittance that the right have no morals! By equating BLM with the left! Well done.

 

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I struggle with the rights and wrongs with much of this debate 

I am concern about judging historys rights on wrongs on today’s values is worrying , as whose values are they, the west’s the East’s, any number of religious groups or ethnic or social groups. Knowing that the process will happen again in future years with a different set of values 

i know we have all done some things right and somethings wrong as individuals or groups or as a society but we have also done somethings right. 
 

I get a little tired of people jumping on some moral trending bandwagon.. genuinely think people should look at how they behave all the time and not just because something is popular 


remember let he who is free of sin cast the first stone.. I won’t be casting stones.. I will continue to reflect on how I go about my daily life. 
we should treat all people as we would want to be treated 
 

 

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15 minutes ago, Nick said:

I struggle with the rights and wrongs with much of this debate 

I am concern about judging historys rights on wrongs on today’s values is worrying , as whose values are they, the west’s the East’s, any number of religious groups or ethnic or social groups. Knowing that the process will happen again in future years with a different set of values 

i know we have all done some things right and somethings wrong as individuals or groups or as a society but we have also done somethings right. 
 

I get a little tired of people jumping on some moral trending bandwagon.. genuinely think people should look at how they behave all the time and not just because something is popular 


remember let he who is free of sin cast the first stone.. I won’t be casting stones.. I will continue to reflect on how I go about my daily life. 
we should treat all people as we would want to be treated 
 

 

Well said, Its just a shame those English slave traders didnt follow that advice!

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2 hours ago, Wilder Bollox said:

There is no such thing as left wing footballers . You can call them anything you want but don't call them footballers . All footballers are right wingers and will be meeting in The South Stand bar at 7.45 where Chadders will be playing party games and telling jokes

Bit harsh as a punishment tbh

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37 minutes ago, chrisbo61 said:

I like your very subtle admittance that the right have no morals! By equating BLM with the left! Well done.

 

Meant far left clearly.  No admittance of anything but you have proved my point about divisiveness.

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1 minute ago, never_shay_die said:

Meant far left clearly.  No admittance of anything but you have proved my point about divisiveness.

Sorry mate, but in all fairness I dont want to be joined with right wing nut jobs!

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10 minutes ago, chrisbo61 said:

Well said, Its just a shame those English slave traders didnt follow that advice!

Have a look at the 2 police getting attacked in Hackney yesterday afternoon! 

Wonder if Sky News & the BBC will broadcast that? 

Racism is a two way thing. 

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2 minutes ago, chrisbo61 said:

Sorry mate, but in all fairness I dont want to be joined with right wing nut jobs!

The right and left both have validity in most cases (obviously not the extremist views).  But it seems that a lot of people are so entrenched one way or another that they are quick to place labels on anyone who doesn't support their view.  Balance is needed (sounding like a star wars film now!)

I have been called both a gammon and a libtard in social media!

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19 minutes ago, chrisbo61 said:

Well said, Its just a shame those English slave traders didnt follow that advice!

Interesting that many of them in their death gave their fortunes away.. was this a repentance or seeking a glory in death 

I do believe that you should not be solely judged on your sins of the past .. I find it troubling when someone who says something foolish decades before is hunted for their head and told to resign 

but at the same time having statues to glorify an individual is often wrong. But removing it then washes that individual from the debate and rewrites a part of history 

which is why I say I find the debate troubling .. as there are few completely wrongs and even less completely rights  

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8 minutes ago, ashy1966 said:

Have a look at the 2 police getting attacked in Hackney yesterday afternoon! 

Wonder if Sky News & the BBC will broadcast that? 

Racism is a two way thing. 

Was the attack on the police racist? Its exactly the same debate as the killing in the USA. Was it racist.

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1 minute ago, Nick said:

Interesting that many of them in their death gave their fortunes away.. was this a repentance or seeking a glory in death 

I do believe that you should not be judged in your sins of the past .. I find it troubling when someone who says something foolish decades before is hinted for their head and told to resign 

but at the same time having statues to glorify an individual is often wrong. But removing it then washes that individual from the debate and rewrites a part of history 

which is why I say I find the debate troubling .. as there are few completely wrongs and even less completely rights  

Nobody gave a **** about statues in this Country till the George Floyd incident. 

They are now targeting Robert Baden Powell now. It, s getting bloody ridiculous. Take the Great out of Britain & have done with it!! 

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34 minutes ago, ashy1966 said:

Have a look at the 2 police getting attacked in Hackney yesterday afternoon! 

Wonder if Sky News & the BBC will broadcast that? 

Racism is a two way thing. 

Yep saw it on the bbc website!

Police get attacked every day! Get a grip.

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27 minutes ago, ashy1966 said:

Nobody gave a **** about statues in this Country till the George Floyd incident. 

They are now targeting Robert Baden Powell now. It, s getting bloody ridiculous. Take the Great out of Britain & have done with it!! 

There have been protests about these statues for years, some at the time of their erection, this isnt something new!

Are you seriously of the belief that the' Great' in Great Britain means it's actually great?

 

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5 minutes ago, chrisbo61 said:

There have been protests about these statues for years, some at the time of their erection, this isnt something new!

Are you seriously of the belief that the' Great' in Great Britain means it's actually great?

 

You really are something else! 

Makes it OK then? 

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A person who held racist views back when they were common, when almost everyone held those views, cannot realistically be judged by today's standards. People were taught that the white man was superior. It was a genuinely held belief for many, the same as many believed that the British were superior to the French, well superior to everyone. Nationalist chauvinism was how you displayed loyalty.

However, someone who earned their fortune from slavery or who otherwise supported slavery at a time when it was already controversial - as it was even then - can and should be judged, especially if they never showed any contrition for their acts or opinions.

It's like those governments who allow their country's rainforests to be torn down. They will be judged by history to have done wrong and to have knowingly done so.

Churchill held racist views, that's not up for dispute. Most were formed by experience. He believed Afghans to be uncivilised which would arguably be a fair comment even today, but he held the Japanese and Chinese in high regard. His views of the people of the Indian subcontinent have been heavily criticised, and while his generalisations were abhorrent, he had huge respect for many individuals from India. He was pro-Jewish and didn't have a high opinion of Arabs, but was adamant that both should be treated equally in Palestine. He was a man of his time, but it has to be said, a modern politician would be unable to admit holding the same views.

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2 hours ago, never_shay_die said:

How dare people vote differently!

Not a case of that at all , more a case of uninformed people voting for something that is both ridiculous and damaging to the country.

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Just now, chrisbo61 said:

Not a case of that at all , more a case of uninformed people voting for something that is both ridiculous and damaging to the country.

What winds me up the most about Brexit is that many leave voters fell hook, line and sinker for the lies, and clung to them long after they were demonstrated to be lies. Rather than admit they voted with their heart instead of their head, or because they didn't want the French and Germans to have any say over our laws, or whatever reasonable reason they could have given, some will hold the 'Turkey' card or the 'European army' card or the 'EU is undemocratic' card to their dying breath, and anyone who challenges them is being divisive or hasn't accepted the result, or is anti-democracy or whatever. It's patently ridiculous.

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9 minutes ago, Bubba said:

A very long read, but JK Rowling has been attacked by 'the mob'. Different to racism but another example on how certain elements of society dont respect opposing views and will do their utmost to shut them up.

https://www.jkrowling.com/opinions/j-k-rowling-writes-about-her-reasons-for-speaking-out-on-sex-and-gender-issues/

I'll argue politics all day, but christ on a bike I'm not going to get involved in that issue!

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1 minute ago, Hoddie said:

What winds me up the most about Brexit is that many leave voters fell hook, line and sinker for the lies, and clung to them long after they were demonstrated to be lies. Rather than admit they voted with their heart instead of their head, or because they didn't want the French and Germans to have any say over our laws, or whatever reasonable reason they could have given, some will hold the 'Turkey' card or the 'European army' card or the 'EU is undemocratic' card to their dying breath, and anyone who challenges them is being divisive or hasn't accepted the result, or is anti-democracy or whatever. It's patently ridiculous.

Absolutely! And I've yet to hear one tangible, evidence based benefit of leaving!

On a purely selfish note, I dont care, my plan has been to retire to my place in spain, I dont think that will be very easy now, due to income levels etc! Very frustrating.

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