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My campaign to get VAR kicked out of the game got a great big helping hand yesterday with the fiasco at Everton. The two major incidents where it was called upon and two absolutely abysmal decisions. Even without VAR, how did the referee not send Pickford off for his assault on Van Dyke. Anywhere else on the pitch and an outfield player would have been walking voluntarily to the tunnel before the Ref got his card out. What really surprises me is that the ref was Michael Oliver who is by far the best of the top officials currently doing the rounds. Early reports suggest Van Dyke may be out for the rest of the season. Perhaps this ought to be one of those rare occasions where the FA step in and ban Pickford anyway, an horrendous challenge. The second VAR decision was the offside given against Mane that ruled out Hendersons late goal that would have won Liverpool the game. If thats off side then we may as well wrap up now. If you havent seen it then watch the highlights!!! But all this does is add weight to the fact that VAR is essentially a waste of time, GET IT OUT.

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I find it odd that becuase the player was in an offside position it does count .. ie he should not have been there 

so does that mean if the player is in an offside position you can just punch his lights out or bust his leg and it doesn’t matter 

crazy .. dangerous play is dangerous play .., full stop he should be cited and banded 

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18 minutes ago, Wilder Bollox said:

The ref has little power to deal with such incidents and they are dealt with at a later date (having not seen the incident myself)

In footballing terms its as bad as you get nowadays!! I really do hope that the powers that be step in on this one.

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The offside rule needs to be changed so that if any part of your body is onside, then you are just that, onside.

You celebrate a goal now only to find out that your big toe is offside so it doesn't count is absolute crazy, and It also causes havoc in the stands as it irritates the supporters.

Edited by Guido
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37 minutes ago, TommyH72 said:

My campaign to get VAR kicked out of the game got a great big helping hand yesterday with the fiasco at Everton. The two major incidents where it was called upon and two absolutely abysmal decisions. Even without VAR, how did the referee not send Pickford off for his assault on Van Dyke. Anywhere else on the pitch and an outfield player would have been walking voluntarily to the tunnel before the Ref got his card out. What really surprises me is that the ref was Michael Oliver who is by far the best of the top officials currently doing the rounds. Early reports suggest Van Dyke may be out for the rest of the season. Perhaps this ought to be one of those rare occasions where the FA step in and ban Pickford anyway, an horrendous challenge. The second VAR decision was the offside given against Mane that ruled out Hendersons late goal that would have won Liverpool the game. If thats off side then we may as well wrap up now. If you havent seen it then watch the highlights!!! But all this does is add weight to the fact that VAR is essentially a waste of time, GET IT OUT.

Was there any reaction to the tackle from the players Tommy? 

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Anyway amendments need to be made to the offside rule. Again applying common sense should be used. If there's an armpit or a toe offside you shouldn't be given offside that side of it is a joke. 

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1 minute ago, Guido said:

The offside rule needs to be changed so that if any part of your body is onside, then you are just that, onside.

You celebrate a goal now only to find out that your big toe is offside so it doesn't count is absolute crazy, and It also causes havoc in the stands as it irrates the supporters.

For anyone who hasnt seen this particular decision and who supports VAR please find the MotD highlights and have a look at the analysis, those lines that the VAR system uses do not show a clear piece of any part of Mane that is offside, and yet they looked at Pickfords challenge and decided that it was ok???

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4 minutes ago, Greggs said:

Was there any reaction to the tackle from the players Tommy? 

Yes, and Van Dyke needed a spell of treatment before being lead away. Goalkeepers in general get away with murder.

Edited by TommyH72
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4 minutes ago, shaymen_x said:

You can't blame the technology for any of this. Its the idiot human beings that run it, they must be on another planet to the rest of us. 

I agree Shaymen_X, but therein lays the answer!! Human error which means its no different to just letting the referee do his job. Yes he is prone to error as are we all, but that IMO made it a far more exciting game, not the clinical stuff stuff we see now. Besides, for many years I though a lot of stuff could have been sorted by having 2 referees actually on the pitch, basically one in each half, it would allow the ref to keep up with the game better as he's only covering half of the pitch, and therefore less likely to miss important things going on in the course of the game. In one sided games if one ref is basically doing all the work getting run ragged then they could rotate to give each other a breather, remember they are trying to keep up with "elite" athletes.

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5 minutes ago, TommyH72 said:

I agree Shaymen_X, but therein lays the answer!! Human error which means its no different to just letting the referee do his job. Yes he is prone to error as are we all, but that IMO made it a far more exciting game, not the clinical stuff stuff we see now. Besides, for many years I though a lot of stuff could have been sorted by having 2 referees actually on the pitch, basically one in each half, it would allow the ref to keep up with the game better as he's only covering half of the pitch, and therefore less likely to miss important things going on in the course of the game. In one sided games if one ref is basically doing all the work getting run ragged then they could rotate to give each other a breather, remember they are trying to keep up with "elite" athletes.

Is it human error. Or is it failure to implement common sense into the decision making to run alongside the technology. Alot of these controversial decisions can be cleaned up with the application of common sense 

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26 minutes ago, Greggs said:

Is it human error. Or is it failure to implement common sense into the decision making to run alongside the technology. Alot of these controversial decisions can be cleaned up with the application of common sense 

Sense isn't common. The problem is that most people think they have common sense, but we know that's not true when we judge others. 

Some of the laws of the game are ambiguous and others are made on the hoof (such as recent quick changes and reversals in hand ball rules etc.).

As for VAR offside: I'm a fan of having clear daylight between both players. I'm not sure if the clear daylight should be between chest/upper back or total. That's open for debate by someone else. 

 

Edited by shaymen_x
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I have just watched todays Ajax game and Ajax had a penalty claim for handball, the question being whether it was just inside or outside the area. VAR took ages reviewing the incident then the ref got a call and went over to the touch line to review the incident before awarding Ajax a penalty. This series of events took quite a few minutes to sort out so it must of been very marginal decision so surely VAR should of let it go as I thought they were there for obvious mistakes. I don't know if there is a time limit on how long it takes to arrive at a decision but if not I think there should be otherwise we could be waiting hours for a game to be completed.

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1 hour ago, Greggs said:

Is it human error. Or is it failure to implement common sense into the decision making to run alongside the technology. Alot of these controversial decisions can be cleaned up with the application of common sense 

Possibly Greggs, but it's still the human error portion that is mainly in question, just as it is when left to the referee!!

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1 hour ago, Shaymen2008 said:

I have just watched todays Ajax game and Ajax had a penalty claim for handball, the question being whether it was just inside or outside the area. VAR took ages reviewing the incident then the ref got a call and went over to the touch line to review the incident before awarding Ajax a penalty. This series of events took quite a few minutes to sort out so it must of been very marginal decision so surely VAR should of let it go as I thought they were there for obvious mistakes. I don't know if there is a time limit on how long it takes to arrive at a decision but if not I think there should be otherwise we could be waiting hours for a game to be completed.

If we had had VAR at our Woking game yesterday we would have had a penalty for the foul on Allen!! But I agree mate, It needs to be eliminated from the game completely?

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19 hours ago, shaymen_x said:

You can't blame the technology for any of this. Its the idiot human beings that run it, they must be on another planet to the rest of us. 

Exactly. I’d go one step further and say it’s the guidelines they follow on how they’re supposed to use the technology. VAR is fine in principal but it’s being implemented terribly.

VVD being offside negates the foul, in that Liverpool don’t get the penalty, and if it had been just a normal trip that would have been the end of it. But it was a terrible challenge, no doubt, he was extremely lucky not to be punished. The offside was laughable too. I was rooting for Everton in the game, but even I would have given that goal. Offsides should be done with the naked eye, and only look at a few replays. If you can’t tell then the in field decision stands. It should be there for when a player is 5 feet offside, not 5mm!

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As a part-time Everton fan, I'm 100% behind VAR :D

On a serious note, I agree with riccardo259, the principle of VAR is fine imo, but it is not being used consistently.

Regards contentious off-side decisions and incidents missed by the officials, I would be in favour of giving the referee the option of looking at a replay of the incident, but only in real time (not slowed) and only once, or perhaps once each from two different angles. Then they should make a judgement. That's why they're there.

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football keeps forgetting its a spectator sport.

the tv pound dictated that VAR should be used so they can feel involved in the decisions, entertaining for the slob sat at home pretending to make the decisions but a lousy feature for the crowd in the stadium. So when crowds return I would like to see VAR scrapped. you just can't celebrate goals anymore.

39 minutes ago, Hoddie said:

As a part-time Everton fan, I'm 100% behind VAR :D

On a serious note, I agree with riccardo259, the principle of VAR is fine imo, but it is not being used consistently.

Regards contentious off-side decisions and incidents missed by the officials, I would be in favour of giving the referee the option of looking at a replay of the incident, but only in real time (not slowed) and only once, or perhaps once each from two different angles. Then they should make a judgement. That's why they're there.

the referee has already seen it in real time from his angle, so have two linesmen from different angles and the redundant fourth official again from another angle. Surely that's why they are there.

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The freeze frames on Match of the Day don't help matters . In the Liverpool incident he was slightly offside then onside rather than heading into an offside position . It's like the silly ones where you're offside in your own half because you've run backwards 20 yards

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2 hours ago, riccardo259 said:

Exactly. I’d go one step further and say it’s the guidelines they follow on how they’re supposed to use the technology. VAR is fine in principal but it’s being implemented terribly.

VVD being offside negates the foul, in that Liverpool don’t get the penalty, and if it had been just a normal trip that would have been the end of it. But it was a terrible challenge, no doubt, he was extremely lucky not to be punished. The offside was laughable too. I was rooting for Everton in the game, but even I would have given that goal. Offsides should be done with the naked eye, and only look at a few replays. If you can’t tell then the in field decision stands. It should be there for when a player is 5 feet offside, not 5mm!

Should goal line technology not allow goals that are only 5mm over, just the ones that are well over?

 

Edited by greygoose
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5 minutes ago, greygoose said:

Should goal line technology not allow goals that are only 5mm over, just the ones that are well over?

 

It's not the same - goal line technology is done by a computer and accurate to the millimetre, the technology used to do offside calls is done by humans and is not. Until they have the technology to do an offside call to that accuracy then they shouldn't treat it like they do.

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I've just been reading a piece on the current situation regarding the Van Dyke injury. He is going to need surgery and the early suggestion is that he could be out for eight months!! That's a huge blow to Liverpool, how do you replace a player like him, well they cant do anything now till January by which time they could well be out of contention in both the Domestic & European trophies. Strangely I haven't seen any comments from the FA regarding Pickford and whether they intend to take any action against him. The more I've looked at the challenge the worse it gets, it isn't a tackle its an assault. If Van Dyke is out of the game for Eight months then Pickford should be suspended for eight months. Well that's my take on it.

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2 minutes ago, TommyH72 said:

I've just been reading a piece on the current situation regarding the Van Dyke injury. He is going to need surgery and the early suggestion is that he could be out for eight months!! That's a huge blow to Liverpool, how do you replace a player like him, well they cant do anything now till January by which time they could well be out of contention in both the Domestic & European trophies. Strangely I haven't seen any comments from the FA regarding Pickford and whether they intend to take any action against him. The more I've looked at the challenge the worse it gets, it isn't a tackle its an assault. If Van Dyke is out of the game for Eight months then Pickford should be suspended for eight months. Well that's my take on it.

They’ve said that no action will be taken because the incident was ‘seen at the time’, I believe

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